THE DEBATE #1 - engines

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maddison
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THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 1:06 pm

this is just a little idea for the mag - regular areas of discussion like engines, suspension, interiors, etc etc….
i'd like everyone to join in, hopefully from the 'debate' I can then put together a pro's & cons list for the feature

Debate # 1 engines

2 sides, stock or modified (or sitting on the fence if you must)

pro's & cons of each


I will start the 'debate' for the stock camp

Pro's

Stock is more reliable
All the parts work in harmony, if you replace 1 part, you know it will work with the others
cheaper to build & maintain
easier to source replacement parts
its how VW intended


join in ;-)

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funkyfreakapotomus
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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by funkyfreakapotomus » Fri May 29, 2015 1:36 pm

I too am from the stock brigade!

VW at the time invested time researching and refining to get to that point!

Why change it? Everything works like "clockwork" and it helps when looking at manuals as they look the same lol!!
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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by ted698 » Fri May 29, 2015 1:48 pm

I like stock, but I also like modified, there's only one thing for it! FIIIIGHT!!!!!! hahahahaha

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by the bus driver » Fri May 29, 2015 2:17 pm

Just for the record I'm not choosing any sides I have both options to run and like them both equally.
maddison wrote:
Stock is more reliable
Really??

Obviously your comment is based on an assumption and not on facts.
maddison wrote: its how VW intended
Agreed but then Improved..

Ie. my engine has never even peaked above 89 degrees celsius even with temps reaching 40 outside. I have got a better cooling system than the OG. Also added a larger oil cooler. Result = equal colors on my cylinders. (I have only ever heard my external cooling come on twice in the last 3 years)
Cylinder 3 is the first to melt down when your engine is overheating, this is a failure by VW = proven fact!
maddison wrote: cheaper to maintain
Again, I think your comment is an assumption. (it all depends on what setup you use and how well your engine is build)

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 2:22 pm

the bus driver wrote:
maddison wrote:
Stock is more reliable
Really??

Obviously your comment is based on an assumption and not on facts.
its based on my experience

I had a hot JMR 1776 kicking out 120hp which was no end of trouble…great when it ran well, but when anything went wrong it was a nightmare, tempremental carbs, melting coils, leaking oil cooler hoses
my 1500sp hasn't had a single issue since it was installed

there where occasions the 1776 never got me too..or back from my destinations, the 1500 hasn't done that yet

so thats what i'm basing my comment on

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 2:26 pm

the bus driver wrote:J
maddison wrote: its how VW intended
Agreed but then Improved..

Ie. my engine has never even peaked above 89 degrees celsius even with temps reaching 40 outside. I have got a better cooling system than the OG. Also added a larger oil cooler. Result = equal colors on my cylinders. (I have only ever heard my external cooling come on twice in the last 3 years)
Cylinder 3 is the first to melt down when your engine is overheating, this is a failure by VW = proven fact!

Is your oil getting hot enough to do its job on a cold day ?

improved depends on how the modifications have been done and by who, thats why I say more reliable, cos any tom dick or harry can change components, but stick with stock well maintained components and the engine will in most cases be fault free, start messing (when you don't fully understand what your doing) and every change is a step closer to the recovery truck

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 2:28 pm

the bus driver wrote:Just for the record I'm not choosing any sides I have both options to run and like them both equally.
what are the main things you like about both the stock and the modified engines….

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by Bathtub57 » Fri May 29, 2015 2:38 pm

I'd say it all comes down to who built it, maintains it and what parts are used. It's VERY rare to see a stock engine these days, inevitably they'll have aftermarket dissy, coil, plug leads etc etc mainly as og parts are no longer available or are beyond servicing. Even the best 'stock' engines will often be missing bits of tinware or thermostats which will affect their reliability.

My 2276 in the beetle has proven to be the most reliable motor I own but that was built by John Maher and serviced by Terry's so I'd expect that to be the case.

I'd say stock or modified makes no difference it's all down to doing things properly.
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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by NikC » Fri May 29, 2015 2:38 pm

I'm about to put a type 4 engine in my Westy, did look at Subaru for a while, but thinking long term resale value I figured that type 4 would be more appealing to the majority !
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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 2:50 pm

Bathtub57 wrote:
I'd say stock or modified makes no difference it's all down to doing things properly.
but…for a relative DIY novice (or even just a DIY home mechanic) , would you say a stock engine is easier to maintain that a highly modified one

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 2:50 pm

NikC wrote:I'm about to put a type 4 engine in my Westy, did look at Subaru for a while, but thinking long term resale value I figured that type 4 would be more appealing to the majority !
will you be modifying the type 4 engine…or leaving it as VW designed it

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by maddison » Fri May 29, 2015 2:51 pm

by the way….i'm not looking to reach or find a conclusion here…..just open opinions on which is better and why

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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by NikC » Fri May 29, 2015 2:51 pm

100% leaving it as VW intended !

(I did look at Porsche cooling, but the cost was prohibitive).
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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by Bathtub57 » Fri May 29, 2015 3:14 pm

maddison wrote:
Bathtub57 wrote:
I'd say stock or modified makes no difference it's all down to doing things properly.
but…for a relative DIY novice (or even just a DIY home mechanic) , would you say a stock engine is easier to maintain that a highly modified one
100% agree. Using a Haynes manual or Idiots guide and keeping things standard is the best way to keep your Vw reliable for the average diy mechanic (like me). Modified motors - especially when you don't know who has done what - is a minefield. My vans motor is a nice 1641 on 34 ict's but I'll swap it back for the og 1500 when I finish rebuilding it as I'll know exactly what's inside it. I wouldn't attempt the 2276 with electronic ignition, twin carbs, external fans etc.
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Re: THE DEBATE #1 - engines

Post by modifiedbrian » Fri May 29, 2015 4:49 pm

Modified aircooled.

Once you've turned to the dark side there's no going back.
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